Kingfish Debate - ABC Radio Precis 26/2/03
Submitted by SARFAC Wednesday, 26th February 2003
Reference : ABC PORT PIRIE North and West Morning Show 9:22AM ACST Wednesday, 26 February 2003

ABC PORT PIRIE North and West Morning Show 9:22AM ACST Wednesday, 26 February 2003

Joseph Thompson interviews Trevor Watts, SA Recreational Fishing Advisory Council, about misleading information about rogue kingfish. Watts claims the kingfish problem is "forcing environmental changes" and accuses the SA Aquaculture Industry of contributing to the problems by denying that large amounts of kingfish are escaping out of their pens. He says, "we are calling for a full and detailed independent audit" on fish stocks, to prove that there is a severe threat to the Spencer Gulf. Radio Precis

Trevor Watts, Executive Officer, SA Recreational Fishing Advisory Council - Kingfish debate

[Thomson:] ... the South Australian Recreational Fishing Advisory Council have accused the South Australian aquaculture industry of deception and cover-ups but where's the proof? Trevor Watts ... how do you back up these accusations?

[Watts:] ... this is a sorry saga ... and I have a great deal of sympathy for the Minister in the way that he's been misinformed by his department ... the Primary Industries portfolio is too big for one Minister to cope with and fisheries should be a separate and single ministry ... we are forcing environmental change at a pace that naturally took thousands of years to evolve and society cannot cope with overnight change such as this that we're placing on the environment.

[Thomson:] ... you're suggesting that large numbers of Kingfish are escaping, according to official documentation that you have from PIRSA?

[Watts:] Yes, that is the case ... I have just ... received a background media release on Yellow Tail Kingfish and they're still insisting that only small numbers ... have escaped from farms in South Australian waters.

[Thomson:] But does this documentation actually backup what you're saying with your accusations?...

[Watts:] Yes ... when we first drew the community's attention to this issue over a year ago ... escapes were completely denied by the department.

[Thomson:] ... you were good enough to fax that through ... we might even read this out ... this is a notification of less than a month ago ... it says 'Re notification of escapes of Yellow Tail Kingfish. PIRSA Aquaculture has been notified of two escapes of Yellow Tail Kingfish both on January 30 2003. Approximately 3,000 fish averaging 19 grams were lost in Fitzgerald Bay due to gear failure during a transfer. At Poverty Bay, 5,000 fish averaging 1.7 kilos escaped after their cage was damaged by a shark attack but almost all these fish were recaptured by netting.

[Watts:] ... the key word there is ... almost ...

[Thomson:] So you're saying it's unclear how many weren't recaptured.

[Watts:] ... this is one of the reasons why we're calling for a full and detailed independent audit which is easily conducted ... that should demonstrate to the community the missing fish.

[Thomson:] Don't these documents prove that there's no cover- up, they've recorded all of the escapes, not covering them up.

[Watts:] Well, why is the Minister saying only 8,000 have escaped and why are they in their own media releases saying only small numbers have escaped and why did they deny it in the beginning when the data that you obviously have there says that another 8,000 have escaped since 2001 ... these are only the recorded escapes.

[Thomson:] What evidence is there that Kingfish are escaping every time the nets are changed? ...I believe that the Minister ... I've got one of his press releases actually here saying that there's no evidence at all that there's escapes happening when the nets are changed so how do you know that that's happening?

[Watts:] ... we had a meeting with the Aquaculture Department and other members of Primary Industries and this what was conveyed to us. We were unaware of this at that particular time.

[Thomson:] ... we'll have to follow that up with the Minister ...

[Watts:] ... in Spain, we have probably one of the world's largest on land fish tanks ... also have 600 land tanks which proves that this type of activity can be conducted on land and during that process, the scientists over there claim it requires a 10 year research cycle ... before they go ahead in a fully blown project ... many other industries have to produce pilot plants such as the pellet plant in Whyalla, to demonstrate that such an industry or a production process is economically viable. What we're doing here is ... doing our research on the run and who knows what damage we're doing to the environment.

[Thomson:] ... these Kingfish are increasing in numbers right around the country, not just here in the Gulf ... even if it was proved that we had greater numbers in the Gulf, that doesn't necessarily mean ... that they're coming from aquaculture.

[Watts:] ... we do know that there's upwards to 18,000 which have been admitted floating around the Gulf.

Paul Holloway, Minister for Agriculture, Food & Fisheries - Kingfish debate

[Thomson:] ... Fisheries Minister Paul Holloway ... yes you are on a mobile phone and we can tell you're on the train still, are you?

[Holloway:] ... yes ...

[Thomson:] ... you have previously said that there have been no more than 3,000 to 5,000 Kingfish escape yet the documents from PIRSA would appear to prove otherwise ...

[Holloway:] ... no well the information that we were provided ... to SARFAC shows that there has been a total of 9,000 over the last two years ... about 3,000 escaped ... last year ... that's when this really came to attention as a result of that ... asked [unclear] to provide some policy ... that was the time we spoke to the owners of the farms to try and work with them to over come the problem ...

[Thomson:] ... what about this notification from PIRSA that says on January 30 this year 3,000 fish lost from Fitzgerald Bay and at Poverty Bay another 5,000 fish

[Holloway:] ... sorry I couldn't hear that question ...

[Thomson:] ... yes we are labouring a bit here ... its breaking up ... we have an official notification from PIRSA ...

[Holloway:] ... in relation to those ... a lot of those fish ... were very small and most of them were caught and recaptured ... the fact that we're getting the reports in that level of detail ... SARFAC was informed about it ... I really am disappointed that a group like SARFAC is actually pushing around information now that it really knows isn't true ... the key thing to this issue ... SARFAC have a job to do in terms of looking after recreational fish issues ... there is no evidence to suggest that even if there are more Kingfish ... that its having an impact ...

[Thomson:] ... SARFAC wants an independent audit of all transactions over the last two years ... if there is any difference ... what's your response to that? ... we might have to get you on a landline at another time ... when your off the mobile ....

Caller Allan, Ceduna - Kingfish debate

[Caller Allan:] Henry's spot on. ... the Minister and the Department have been making much about the increase in the population of kingfish in New South Wales. Unfortunately the minister's advisers haven't given him the whole story. In New South Wales they used to use floating fish traps to catch kingfish ... they are very efficient ... they fished the kingfish population down to dangerously low levels in commercial terms, so the fish traps were banned ... this increase in population in New South Wales is actually to stop recovering following the banning of the fish traps ... it's got nothing to do with this miraculous surge in population that they keep referring to.

[Thomson:] How do you know that?

[Caller Allan:] Because of my knowledge of the fishing industry. The fish traps were banned by NSW Fisheries.

[Thomson:] Are those fish traps banned in South Australia?

[Caller Allan:] Yes, they are in that the entrance size on the fish traps is strictly controlled to a size that fish as large as kingfish can't enter. They're used really only for leather jacket fishing. In New South Wales they used to tether a path on the surface, and the kingfish aggregate under any surface object, and they'd suspend a trap underneath the carp, and it was a very efficient way of catching kingfish, and it knocked the population around quite severely.

[Thomson:] If that's the case, when are you saying that they actually ... banned those traps? How long ago was that?

[Caller Allan:] It's in the four to six year range. I'm sorry, I can't be more precise than that, but it's a matter of public record, and really the department should have known that.

Caller Jeff - Kingfish debate

[Caller Jeff:] There are a whole lot of rumours going around at the moment. I'd like the minister to be able to deny these rumours, is that the kingfish have been let go simply because there was no market for the kingfish. My understanding from the rumours is that they become uneconomic to feed ... these fish were released. I'd like the minister to be able to deny that rumour. It's running all over the State .. Yorke Peninsula right through to Port Augusta. I'd just like the minister to be able to deny that.

[Thomson:] That they're possibly letting them go because the market isn't big enough for the amount that they had. Is that what you're saying?

[Caller Jeff:] That's correct, yeah.

[Thomson:] All right. Well that's another point that we'll have to put to the minister when we get hold of him on a landline.